I think, the easiest way to take care of griefers and teamkillers is the rank system. The more points you have, the higher rank you take, and the higher rank you have, the more thing you can do.
But first of all, the intel carrier killers should take bonus points, for example 5 points for 1 kill.
With 0 point everybody could use only the rifle. Nobody could build or destroy anything. So the first part of the game would be only fighting while using the terrain advantages.
With 5 points (5 kills / 1 intel carrier kill / 1 intel capture) the players could be builders and could build, mine, and destroy, but only their own buildings or the buildings of their enemies.
With 15 points the player could be grenadier, could use the grenades and could destroy the buildings of his teammates too.
With 35 points the player should become sergeant with the right to kick any of his teammates below his rank.
With these ranks, the griefers couldn't destroy anything on the map from the beginning, and they couldn't grenadespamming. But if they reach 15 points only to start griefing, the sergeant can kick him immediately.

And one more thing, the teamkillers. It's easy. If anybody kills his teammate, he automatically changes side and loses all of his points. At this point, he will find himself in the middle of the territory of his ex-teammates, who have the right to shoot him down for an easy frag.

"With 35 points the player should become sergeant with the right to kick any of his teammates below his rank."

no

why no?

Because nobody could possibly abuse it.

Only an other player, who has more points...

get 35 points, kick half the server

whoops

Team killing is working great for me in stopping griefing.

E.g. you spot someone digging out a bridge, go shoot them in the head, wait 30 seconds for them to comeback and start again, shoot them in the head. usually after the 3rd or 4th time they get the idea and switch sides, in which case follow them. After that they quit the server. Griefing the griefers works.

Hm, then kick should have cool down time, 1 minute maybe. After 3 illegal kicks everybody will know there is a kicker griefer, and can kick him on the regular way.
Or kick could cost 5 or 10 points, so to kick more, you have to kill more enemy.
Or we can raise it from 35 to 50. I didn't see any griefer with 50 points since I playing this game.

Griefing the griefers is a lots of time.
I did it before the teamkill came out. I was always digging under the griefer, so he couldn't reach the building, that he wanted to destroy. After that, he wanted to escape, but I continued the underdigging, and when he wanted to build stairs to escape underground, I have destroyed the stairs too. At last, he leaved the server, but our team lost a lots of points while I was playing anti-griefer.

Most of what you have said, I disagree with. However, I do agree with the title.

Forced account creation? Sounds good to me. Link the account to an IP/MAC address and then people can be banned completely from their computer.
The account could keep track of amount of votekicks, and issue global sentences.

I disagree with everything else. Earning ranks that allow for kicking of others, earning the right to use grenades ...
Moderator positions etc I would not be against, but under your system some idiot could play for ages then start kicking loads of people.

I could abuse this easily, sounds like fun, I say it should be implemented.

Sergeant's don't even have that kind of authority in the military. You are fucking retarded.

Ok, it was just an idea. If nobody likes it, I will play this game on the old way. :)

I agree on this one:

the intel carrier killers should take bonus points, for example 5 points for 1 kill.

All the other stuff is too much complicated atm I think and needs much more discussion first.

Noire: "You are fucking retarded. "
How's that day treating you?

Fucking hate rank system. There will always be idiots who plays for a good k\d only.

Eh, bad idea, but if there was such a thing as rankings it should be at least 150+, which is pretty easily attained. I think it's funny when I knock down someone's building when I have 250 kills and they start bitching and telling people to kick me and I'm like "I have 250 kills, more than the rest of the team combined, your argument is invalid, everyone kick this fuck" and then the guy I griefed gets kicked. I would abuse this system so much if it ever happened.

intel capper shouldn't ever get 5 bonus points from each kill, he already gets 10 points for scoring. Which is good enough, and actually the best solution.

If this is based on kills, what's to stop some random hacker form killing everyone, accumulating 35 points, and kicking everyone? Exactly.

Any system like this can be flawed. "Hey lets join this server and vote everyone down. " "Okay!"

It should be similar to what TheGrandmaster said.

And how about if you get 4million kills you can kick the server from existence.

We don't actually need a 100% anti-grief system. We need one that allows most servers, at most times of day, with the average mix of pub players, to allow normal play. Which could mean something as low as 80-90% grief-free-hours.

There are always going to be exceptional cases, like the infamous myg0t clan(who take a very technically adept and organized approach to griefing; I recall being in a TFC game with just one of them many years ago, and he used some amazing hack that allowed blatant noclipping across the map). We shouldn't worry about exceptions.

Right now we are at about 10% grief-free-hours. Either the server is almost empty, or you have an endless stream of Deuces coming in, contributing little, and griefing in exactly the same ways, which is very tedious to combat, though we at least have a method of doing so now.

I think a good solution could involve changing the time/effort dynamics with progression and rank-ups, but _not_ in a way that allows powers like kicking other players. Those are powers that should exist outside of normal gameplay.

Instead, when you start the game it should be an extremely slow process to build or destroy anything, if it's even possible. For example maybe you can only use the pick, and it works at the speed of the spade, and you can only carry 5-10 blocks. Then, only after ranking up will it be possible to use your construction powers normally. And maybe there's bonuses by the time you hit 100 points. This could go hand-in-hand with things like adding more powerful artillery or construction options.

This combats the "endless Deuces" problem in a very simple way; you can't be any good at griefing until you've played for a while. And if you get kicked for griefing - which is the nuclear option, because it intrudes so much on regular gameplay to go through the tedium of kicking someone - you start over from square 1 and are a bad griefer again(until you play normally some more). Regular players don't get kicked; they might suffer from disconnects, but the game is stable enough now that most people don't seem to be affected by that.

Now I totally see that my kicker idea was a big fail, so I don't think we need further comments about that.
I think the main problem is, that building is too easy, and destroying is extremely easy now. Anybody can build a cage over the command post to prevent intel carrier to capture the intel in 10 seconds. However, this is the minor problem. The worse thing is, that anybody can destroy a 100-200 block big fort by digging out the 30-40 block under it in 1 minute, or can lower a whole hill in 5-10 minutes.
The first time I saw the effect when I destroyed a huge tower with 10 hits, I said "Holy shit! That's what I missed in Minecraft!" But the next second I thought "Wait! The upper blocks suddenly disappeared?! LOL!" Nice feature, I really like it, but that's what the griefers use always. Under-digging. Take out 5-10 blocks, and the whole 50-100 blocks will disappear! I think that's the problem here. I think nothing need to disappear, like in real world. When you mine a block out, it will be in your "inventory", so you can place it somewhere else. The destroying should be similar. When you dig under a tower, the upper parts should fall down, but every blocks of it should remain. And if the player is under it, he should die.
In this case, griefing would become harder, because removing the blocks need more time. And no one would remove a whole hill, if he has to remove it block by block.

Before anybody starts the flame again: This is only an idea. I don't said the developers must make it immediately! I'm just thinking about things, and waiting for other ideas.

How about
admins that actually long on the server.

I'd get bored and quit before I got to 10 points

No. The rules are just too complicated and will most likely be abused.

Here's an idea: ACCEPT THE FACT that as long as you are given a game where you can build and create, there are going to be griefers. Period. I do think it should be a little easier to teamkill because seldom does it ever come in handy for actually killing a griefer, but other than that there isn't that much you can do without installing preposterously unbalanced rules into the game.

What Sasquatch??? Accept the fact that some little kid is going to destroy the game that you play for the sake that they cannot play???

If they cannot play then they should find another game, Not destroy the game for the rest of us.

I seen your other thread saying the quote, It's a load of crap. Griefers are going to happen, BUT... It doesn't mean we need to put up with them.

I only read the first post in the thread, but it seems like you can accomplish this with pyspades: http://code.google.com/p/pyspades/

:-)